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Former Member
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Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

This could have been a BIG mistake. I have the feeling that you could have alienated quite a few crunchers. All other project up to now, possibly Beta excepted, had plenty of WUs to go round to everyone, giving most crunchers chances to gain Badges. With this project, unless there are millions of WU's to come, has given very little chance to gain badges. I had to micro-manage 3 machines in order to get to a Bronze and I suspect that others stand very little chance of even getting that far....please try and avoid doing this type of thing again.
[Apr 16, 2010 7:20:56 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
gb009761
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Scribe, have you read anything about DDDT2 as to how it's arranged?, i.e., the prerun create the type A's, which create type B's and which then finally go on to create the millions of type C's?

Also, have you worked out as to how many of the type A's have been run? - 1 (erlc) type out of (I believe) 18. Yes, there are the ts01-ts06, although these are verification types for the scientists. So, all in all, the project has only just got started.

Frustrating as it may seem, science isn't all plain sailing, in that there are many avenues to check and dead-ends to discover, before we find the right road to travel down. So, all in all, yes it should have gone ahead - albeit in my personal opinion, an intermittent project right from the start.
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[Apr 16, 2010 7:48:15 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

With this project, unless there are millions of WU's to come, has given very little chance to gain badges. I had to micro-manage 3 machines in order to get to a Bronze and I suspect that others stand very little chance of even getting that far....please try and avoid doing this type of thing again.

There ARE millions of WUs to come. They just come slowly due to required manual intervention. And our goal here anyway is the science, not badges.

https://secure.worldcommunitygrid.org/forums/...d,28748_offset,100#274957
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Former Member at Apr 16, 2010 7:55:44 PM]
[Apr 16, 2010 7:54:12 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
hbj78
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Hi,

I've not been around that long but just had to respond to this.

The only crunchers this could have alienated are the ones who expect/assume they will get all DDDT2 WU's all the time. And so what? Most of the users will not even notice.

If you have to micro manage 3 machines to feel you did something I recommend you leave your pc's for a while and relax and enjoy the weather and realize that DDDT2 does not control your world

/Helle
[Apr 16, 2010 8:12:22 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
uplinger
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

gb009761, Your statements are mostly correct. The only thing of confusion could be the label of intermittent and what has been run so far. I'm going to try my best here to explain it.

DDDT2 has been moved to intermittent not because the project is complete (as has been in the past for DDDT1, FLU1, CEP1) but because there will be times when the project won't have new work. Right now this project is in a 2-3 week period without new work. The researchers have received lots of results on their end and need to evaluate what the results show them at this time.

Here is what has run on the grid so far.

erlc - This is 80% returned, some type B batches haven't be run as type C yet.
ts01 - This has returned type A's and some Type B's are running.
ts02 - Same as ts01
ts03 - has not run on the grid (We investigating and issue with preruns)
ts04 - same as ts03
ts05 - only 50% of the type A's have been sent.
ts06 - This has started type C's but has not be returned to the researchers yet (very small batch only 30 type A's to start with)

The actual targets 1-18 have not been run yet, these have a naming convention that has yet to be given to us. Nothing is being run in prerun at this time (it is also in the 2-3 week pause)

So, as you can see, most of the work has been in type A and B, which have the least amount of work units. Type C's are where most will have a chance to run work.

Please remember this project is doing something that has never been done before on such a large scale. So analysing the data takes a lot of time and effort on the researchers end. Which for us as crunchers is patience because we want to give them lots of processing power to complete their research quickly.

The badges for members will come. If we had badges when Africa Climate @ Home was active and completed, members would have been clamouring for more work quickly as well. When that project completed we saw what the cpu runtime was after it was completed to give out badges fairly. I don't think anyone on that project ran for more than 1 year. What I'm saying is, if for some reason this project completes with small cpu usage distribution for the members, we may take a look at requirements for badges, but until then and with the estimation of work to come from the researchers still pretty large, we are going to run with the normal badge distribution.

I hope that I have explained this well, if there are more questions on this, I can respond next Monday.

Thanks,
-Uplinger
[Apr 16, 2010 8:12:56 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Not to forget the demanding requirements (bandwidth, memory) for running those task which prevent almost half of my computers from running even a c-typ task. It would be interesting to know how many WCG members or computers do not meet those requirements...
[Apr 16, 2010 8:20:16 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
gb009761
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Thanks Uplinger for clarifying things biggrin

My own feelings as to why it should have been an intermittent project right from the off, was due to the stop/start nature of the project and that, it was made clear that there would be times when there were no WU's to process (due to the manual steps which are required).
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[Apr 16, 2010 8:22:32 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Badges are for a bit of added interest and fun. We should try to remember that the most important thing is the science and the potential good that could result from the projects.

We have the easy part as crunchers and need to give the scientists and techs a break to get on with what they need to do. The work units will come when they are ready and the badges will follow. peace
[Apr 16, 2010 9:26:56 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Jack007
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Well said Whl (and others)
and, admit it, struggling to get a Bronze in DDDT2
has been FUN! wasn't it that much more enjoyable
after the minutes of slaving away changing settings,
then to just see another emerald or 2 after surfing
the web or doing laundry ?
Please note all this has been said with a smile biggrin
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[Apr 16, 2010 10:25:50 PM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
Former Member
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Re: Should DDDT2 Have gone ahead?

Badges are there for a reason. It gives folks something to aim for and if they did not encourage MORE crunching there would be little use is spending time & effort to develope them . .....and please stop saying we are here to crunch for the science not badges. Look at my join date, I was crunching right from the first day, no badges then....also....I started crunching in April 2001 at UD, when the only distributed project was SETI
[Apr 17, 2010 5:14:32 AM]   Link   Report threatening or abusive post: please login first  Go to top 
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